Scout shares her ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ movie secrets

Here’s Mary Badham’s most vivid memory from the 1963 Academy Awards: A lady walks up to Badham, then just 10-years-old, seated in the front of the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium. The lady says to Badham, “Excuse me, dear. We have one extra person in our party and they were seated back here. Could you change seats with us?”

Even though Badham was nominated that night for best Supporting Actress, for her portrayal of Scout in the 1962 film adaptation of Harper Lee’s 1960 Pulitzer-winning novel “To Kill a Mockingbird,” Badham obliged the lady.

She politely moved to another seat, a few rows back.

"And I'm sure the director and the cameraman for the awards were just going ballistic because they probably couldn't find me," Badham recalls now. "So, if I had won anything, they wouldn't have been able to find me to show me. That was a big non-no, but I was just a dumb little kid. What do you know? Kids that were 10 then were much younger than 10 now. It was a totally different time period."

In many ways the early ’60s seem like much longer than almost 60 years ago. Yet, “To Kill a Mockingbird” still resonates with movie audiences. In 1963, Badham lost Best Supporting Actress to teen star Patty Duke, for Duke’s “The Miracle Worker” performance, but “Mockingbird” did just fine, netting three Oscars including Best Actor for Gregory Peck’s now-iconic portrayal of widowed Alabama lawyer Atticus Finch. And Badham’s performance as young Jean Louise “Scout” Finch left footprints in film history too.

After “Mockingbird,” Badham did some more acting, including an episode of classic TV sci-fi show “The Twilight Zone” and 1966 Sydney Pollack-directed film “This Property Is Condemned,” starring Robert Redford, Natalie Wood and Charles Bronson. But she wasn’t an actor before “To Kill Mockingbird.” It wasn’t where her heart or future was either. Badham went on to work in education, among other pursuits. Eventually, things circled back to “Mockingbird” and she’s traveled to schools for years now, talking about Lee’s book and her experiences making the film.

On a recent evening, Badham, a Birmingham native, checked in phone from the Florida residence she shares with her husband. (The couple also maintains a farm property in Virginia.) After finishing the meal of sliced turkey, stuffing and corn she’d prepared and cleaning up, Badham settled in for an extensive “Mockingbird” focused conversation. Over the phone, she sounded bright and full of life and light. Edited excerpts are below.

Mary, looking back, what were a couple of the most exciting scenes for you to shoot for "To Kill a Mockingbird"?

I think it would be all the scenes that we shot up in “The Phantom of the Opera” set, where we did all the exteriors for the night scenes, the Boo Radley scene and all that. That was fun. Because the stage it was like a real old theatre. That’s not there anymore. But up on the stage part of it, they had built Boo Radley’s house, the backyard. And then of course, shooting at night, which we had to get special permission to shoot at night. [Because of her age.]

It was on the back lot of Universal Studios because we shot the whole thing at Universal, so that was one of the sets that was there. I don’t remember the soundstage number, but from what I understand it’s been torn down now, which is really kind of sad. Universal gave us so much history but it’s been through so many owners that just didn’t care of the history of stuff.

History's important and you helped make it on "Mockingbird." You had no prior acting experience. How did the production, studio or director prep you? Did they give you acting lessons, give you Harper Lee's book to go with the script?

I don't even think we got full script. We just got what we needed to learn and that was it, and so I just saw the pages and back then I had a great memory to where I could go through stuff and get int pretty quickly. I wish I had half the memory I had then, now. [Laughs]

How did you get the role? Did you happen across a call for young actors? Were you picked out by a talent scout?

The Reader's Digest of it is that (casting agent) Buddy Boatwright was sent by (producer) Alan Pakula and (director) Bob Mulligan to go out and look for Southern children, and they wanted real Southern children with real Southern accents and they wanted children with real imaginations. They didn't want studio kids, where they had to teach them the accent and get prepped that way. They wanted real children.

Also, Southern children would totally understand the social issues. Because in 1960-whatever, Birmingham hadn’t changed. It was still run by white men, and women and children had no rights, and if a black man so much looked a white woman in the eye, he could be brutally murdered. And there were still the colored-only, white-only (water drinking) fountains. If you were black you had to know where you could go get something to eat and where you could go to the bathroom if you needed to. It was real different. Knowing that they wanted real Southern children.

My mom had been a leading actress with the local Town & Gown Theatre and she’d done a lot of opera, acting of various types. She had her own radio show. James Hatcher, who was head of the little theatre, got in touch with my mother as he did with Phillip’s and other mothers to bring their kids in if they were about the right age for that, and so I went down. [Phillip Alford, also from Birmingham, played Jem Finch, Badham’s onscreen brother in "Mockingbird.'] Well, first my mom had to go and ask my father and my father said no. My mom was so sharp and incredible, and she was like, “Henry, dear, what are the chances the child will get the part anyway? It will be fine.” Oh, well. [Laughs]

But it took a lot of convincing from Alan Pakula and Buddy Boatwright and Bob Mulligan and Gregory Peck to all descend on Daddy and get him to turn my loose, because he was 60-years-old when I was born and he had waited all that time for a little girl. He had all these ratty boys but he didn’t have a little girl and that’s what he really wanted, and so he was not at all pleased with having to turn me over to total strangers and go out to the din of sin, Hollywood. Yeah, they really had a tough time with him. But he finally realized these were good people and true gentleman, and they were going to take real good care of me, which they did. And it was lots of fun.

I bet. Like a lot of people when I think of you in that role of Scout, I have a very clear picture in my mind. And a part of that picture is your haircut. Was that how your hair was cut back then or did they style you that way for the film?

No, that's how it was cut. And I think that was one of things that helped with getting the part, because my hair was already that way.

Before getting involved with the film, Harper Lee was an Alabama author and you're from Birmingham. How aware were you of the book before working on the movie?

Not at all. I had no idea or know who Harper Lee was. I didn’t know anything about the book, and I think that’s the way they wanted it and I think it was better because I was able to just relax and go with whatever. Bob Mulligan was an awesome director, I mean awesome, because he sat the set up like playtime, and basically just let us have a good time, and so it was not hard to do.

When did you eventually go back and read the book?

Not until much later. [Laughs] I mean, my daughter was 2-years-old and the way that happened was that (a professor) from the college called and asked me to come and speak to his English lit class, and I thought, “I don’t know what I’m going to talk about with his English lit class, but OK.” So, he said, “Why don’t we meet for lunch and we’ll talk about it?” So, we met for lunch and before I could even get seated at the table he said, “So, what was your favorite chapter in the book?” And I guess he could tell by the look in my face that I had not read the book. [Laughs] “Young lady, your first assignment is you go home and read this book!” OK. So, I did and then I came back and talked with his students, and that kind of got me on the road and from then on it snowballed.

Ever meet Harper Lee?

Oh yeah. She was on the set, she came to the set and visited with us. She was supposed to stay for three weeks, she came for a week and saw everything was fine and she split. [Laughs] It was just like a big photo shoot while she was there. What she said to me, what I said to her, I have no idea. And I think we did some press stuff afterwards.

While asleep do you ever dream about “To Kill a Mockingbird” or your experiences making the film or anything like that?

No. I don't think I've ever dreamed about it, but I probably will tonight now that you've put that thought in my head!

Any fun stories what Gregory Peck was like between takes or on-set? He's so charismatic onscreen and I read you kept in touch with him up until his passing.

Yeah, he was so great. He was very … See all these guys, Bob Mulligan, Alan Pakula, Gregory Peck, they all had small children at the time, so they could relate to little kids very easily. And I would go to the Pecks' on the weekend and play with his daughter Cecilia and his son Anthony and because my dad was back in Alabama, he had a company to run and other children to take care of, so we didn't get to see each other for most of the time. He came out a time or two to visit, but then he went back.

But yeah, I would go to the Pecks’ and so what you see up on screen is what we got at home. That’s who he was. He was just this great guy who loved being a daddy and he was a great daddy. He had a marvelous sense of humor; he was always trying to make people laugh and enjoyed laughing himself. And he had such a big heart. And he just made it so easy for everybody on the set.

I’ve read a couple different ages for when you made the movie. Were you 9 or 10 when you filmed “To Kill a Mockingbird”?

Well, I think I was 9 when I was hired and then turned 10 because my birthday came in October and it seems to me I went to California in October. I'd have to check that but it seems to me I turned 10 because I vaguely remember a birthday party at some point in California. I think I turned 10 on the set.

At the 1963 Academy Awards, when you were nominated, there were a lot of glamorous people there that night. Frank Sinatra, Sophia Loren, Omar Sharif, Bette Davis …

None of those people I knew. I was not a child of the theatre; I didn't know anything about movies. We didn't even have TV, so I didn't know any of that stuff until after I did the film.

Child actors aren't always effective, whether it's a lack subtly or lack of life experience. What was your biggest challenge as a child actor?

I'd never done any acting, I didn't know anything, I was just out there playing, so for me there was no challenge about it. I think probably the biggest challenge I had was my schoolwork, because we had a student welfare worker, who got all of my work sent from my school and so I was having to go to school and learn everything I needed to know at school, plus learn my lines and do all the work I had to do from morning to night. That was my toughest thing, because I made great grades and I kind of nosedived when I got home because my father had put me in this all-girls private school, and I'd been raised around boys. I didn't know anything about females. It was a totally scary thing, so I was not a happy camper once I got home.

"To Kill a Mockingbird" is one of those movies a lot of people have watched a lot of times. What's a movie or two you've watched a lot?

This is terrible to say but I just don't watch movies. [Laughs] I read books, I garden, I'm very busy with my family, plus working and doing stuff with "Mockingbird" and doing a little bit of acting again. I was in a film about 10 years ago and then just recently had a TV part that I friend of mine wanted me to be in and now I'm supposed to go to New York in July to see about playing Mrs. Dubose for the road crew of "To Kill a Mockingbird" on Broadway.

That's exciting.

Terrifying! Are you kidding? [Laughs] I told them, I said, "You guys are nuts. I've never done theatre; I don't know anything about and have no idea if I can do this." So, I'm going to go up there and see what happens. If it happens it happens and if it doesn't, oh well. I'll just come home and continue being Grandma.

Since you read a lot of books, what's a book you think would make a good movie?

I like historical novels, based in history. I like biographies. And there was a book I read last year I thought, “Man, this would make a cool movie,” but I don’t remember what the name of it was, a historical novel. I like things set in Europe, especially in England because that’s where my family’s from.

Your brother, John Badham, has directed some really big films, including "Saturday Night Fever," "WarGames" and "Short Circuit." Which of his films are you fondest of?

I really loved “Short Circuit.” I loved them all, it’s hard, but “Short Circuit” was so funny, it was so well-down, so cute and the cast was so fun. And he did some others that the only thing I had a problem was that was the time they were really trying to push the boundaries on foul language and sex and all that stuff,and some of the films he made when he was just getting started it was sad for me because I felt like it didn’t need all the four-letter words. It just wasn’t necessarily. Of course, I don’t know his business, I’m speaking personally as a private moviegoer, I don’t like going in and listening to all of that. The people I hang with, they don’t talk that way. But evidently then that was the thing.

He was actually studying drama and philosophy at Yale (when “Mockingbird” happened), and in the worst kind of way wanted to be in the business. That was his goal. And he worked really hard and made it. He started in the mail-room at Universal Studios when he graduated. And he’s just been epic ever since and he’s still working. He’s teaching at Chapman University (in Orange, Calif.) and he’s written some books.

He was there at Yale, working like crazy to get through Yale and my mom calls him and says, “Guess what? Baby sister’s going to be in a movie.” “What? No.” And then, “Guess what? Baby sister’s been nominated for an Academy Award.” Oh, he was ready to flip. I don’t think he’s ever forgiven me for it because I just walked into it like it was nothing. But the genetics are there, from my mother, so …

What's something you saved and still have from making "To Kill a Mockingbird"?

I have my script, that’s all I have. And I have copies of the call sheets somebody sent me. And studio certainly didn’t keep any of that stuff.

And then I was in Virginia (speaking) at one of the schools and we had invited members of the “To Kill a Mockingbird”cast or crew, anybody that could come or call in or whatever, and we hooked up with a lot of the schools in the United States where they could send in faxes or emails or whatever or call on the phone and ask questions.

And they said, “We’ve got a surprise for Ms. Badham,” and this man walks out onstage, I didn’t recognize him, I had no idea who he was, and he’s got something behind his back and he said, “I’m going to make a grown woman cry on national television.” And he did.

Because he pulls out from his back, the box. The box (a key prop from “To Kill a Mockingbird.”) And I opened it up and just lost it. You know the opening credits where you see the box and it’s opened and there’s this stuff in there? That was his box when he was a little boy, and there was a whole bunch of other little stuff in there like Mardi Gras beads and little plastic rings and all this other stuff and I was like, “What is all this other stuff in there?” [Laughs] And he goes, “Oh, my grandkids play with it.” And I’m like, “Oh my God, this thing belongs in the Smithsonian Institute. Don’t tell me that!” But there the lye soap dolls that Whitey had carved out of the lye soap that my Calpurnia (the Finch’s black housekeeper character in “Mockingbird”), Frankie McCall, had made and shipped them out to California, along with hickory nuts and a burlap bag and I forget what else Daddy had shipped out there. There was all that stuff. And oh man, I couldn’t speak for a long time. But that was wonderful, what a surprise. But it’s in New York with his family and that’s good.

You later made the 1966 film “This Property is Condemned” with Robert Redford and Natalie Wood. I still remember as a kid. seeing on the news when she died (under suspicious circumstances, in 1981). What was Natalie Wood like?

I really didn’t get to know her that well. I mean, she was very sweet to me. She was one of the most beautiful women I had ever seen in my life. It would take your breath away. She had those beautiful eyes and just incredible skin and she always used to wear Jungle Gardenia perfume, and so I knew when she was on the set because you could smell it. But she was in a tough time of her life. I don’t think she was very happy then. At all. It was really kind of sad. And it was a tough shoot. It was very hard. I learned what the business was really like with that film. It was not fun.

Where did you watch “To Kill a Mockingbird” for the very first time? Was it at a premiere?

Yes. I forget now where the opening premiere was, but I know we had a premiere in Gadsden and one in Birmingham and I went to like 21 premieres. It got old seeing the film.

What's something you really loved about growing up in Birmingham?

Oh, I think just walking around. Back then we would just walk the neighborhood, and in our particular neighborhood there was some incredible architecture. Most of that’s gone. They’ve torn all that down now in Birmingham but back then there were some incredible homes. But just having the freedom to walk around. From my house, I would walk to ballet school, which you had to go through the park and go around Highland Avenue and all that. And just the freedom to be a kid, playing with my dog out in the yard. And my grandma’s house was next door and my aunt lived there, so it was really wonderful. And that street is still there. And some of the houses I remember across the street are still there, but everything on my side of the street has been torn down.

Do you remember your childhood address?

Yeah, 1223 South 33rd St., off of Highland Avenue.

For you, what's the enduring appeal of "Mockingbird"? Sure you get asked that one a lot.

Well, I think it has so many things we can relate to today, that are important. If you want to talk about single-parent parenting, if you want to talk about medications for illnesses, if you want to talk about mental illness, if you want to talk about racism, bigotry, where we are then and now ... That’s what keeps me busy on the road with schools, talking about the themes of the book.

The more I travel around this world, the more I realize no matter where you are, people, just Average Joe’s, want the same thing. They want good education for their kids, they want a job where they can earn good money, they want a good life for their children. And it’s very hard nowadays to have that. And we have to learn to be tolerant of one another because, what I tell the kids is, no two people are alike. I haven’t had the experiences you’ve had in your life. You haven’t experienced the things I’ve done. We haven’t had the same bad things happen to us and you never know about another person before jumping on the bandwagon to be ugly to them you have to understand what their background is and how they got to be where they are. And the beauty of “Mockingbird” is (Harper Lee) is able to give us all of those lessons that we still have not learned, in one simple little book.

Mary Badham will take part in an in-depth discussion of her role as Scout and ‘To Kill a Mockingbird,” 7 p.m. Feb. 13 at Huntsville Museum of Art, address 300 Church St. S. The event is part of the museum “Voices of Our Times” speaker series. Tickets are $40 for museum members and $60 for non-members. More info: hsvmuseum.org, 256-535-4350.